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Re: [jakartabatch-dev] GitHub milestones for EE 10 , Batch 2.1 (tentative)
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I am looping in Ed and Arjan here. I think they would be the best
people still around to best explain the specification, TCK and API
work done in JSF to support CDI without needlessly disrupting
Spring based deployments. It has allowed Majorra and MyFaces to
continue to work with Spring when CDI is not enabled/present. I
believe the TCK simply checks if CDI is present and enabled before
running a particular set of tests.
Reza Rahman
Jakarta EE Ambassador, Author, Blogger, Speaker
Please note views expressed here are my own as an individual
community member and do not reflect the views of my employer.
On 4/6/2021 8:37 AM, Scott Kurz wrote:
Though I floated the idea of making CDI + Batch
integration a hard requirement, that was just one of a few
options. The consensus seems to have steered more towards
making CDI + Batch integration optional.
Though one could ask: "how is that different from
the status quo?", my answer is that we should require specific behavior in the presence of CDI, and
validate this in the TCK, whereas today the TCK and spec say
nothing at all about this.
I'm hearing from Romain that other specs/TCKs
provide for this type of "CDI optional" stance (JSF?) ... but
I'm not familiar with the details. We need to formalize this
beyond just an informal agreement that you can choose to not
run certain tests and describe your impl differently.
If no one here is familiar enough to point to the
formal approach used in these other specs I can do some
research and get back to us.
---
That all said, Michael, do you see the rough
approach of "formally defining the integration of Batch + CDI,
where CDI is optionally present" as breaking Spring Batch
apps? I would think not so I'd like to learn more about your
concern.
Thanks,
------------------------------------------------------
Scott Kurz
WebSphere / Open Liberty Batch and Developer Experience
skurz@xxxxxxxxxx
--------------------------------------------------------
Romain Manni-Bucau ---04/06/2021
01:44:41 AM---Le mar. 6 avr. 2021 à 00:30, Michael Minella
<mminella@xxxxxxxxxx> a écrit : > Do keep in mind
that
From: Romain
Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau@xxxxxxxxx>
To: jakartabatch
developer discussions <jakartabatch-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: 04/06/2021
01:44 AM
Subject: [EXTERNAL]
Re: [jakartabatch-dev] GitHub milestones for EE 10 , Batch 2.1
(tentative)
Sent by: "jakartabatch-dev"
<jakartabatch-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Le mar. 6 avr. 2021 à 00:30, Michael Minella <mminella@xxxxxxxxxx> a
écrit :
Do keep in mind that the Spec as it
currently exists does not have any CDI specific functionality
in it. The alignment to CDI may break implementations. For
example, I wouldn't expect Spring's DI to work going forward
which is obviously breaking for us.
Strictly speaking it is already there since at least batch
property injection are cdi oriented so components can be CDI beans
by design, so no breaking change to add more about CDI for
spring: https://github.com/eclipse-ee4j/batch-api/blob/0019b27531b3b7d640555bbec94ec7cf3285beca/api/src/main/java/jakarta/batch/api/BatchProperty.java#L41.
Once again, Spring JBatch implementation already bypasses CDI
support so will not change much.
That said there is no feature Spring will not support almost
natively AFAIK, Spring has an event bus too, Spring has scopes too
so sounds all good, TCK just needs to ensure both features are
abstracted in the test and the vendor must provide the impl to let
the TCK be abstract.
It is the way all specs do it and not sure the point to make
JBatch different since at the end it does not prevent Spring usage
at all - you can take JAXRS as an example, Spring does not respect
the CDI part but Spring users are still happy to use it from what
I saw.
Michael Minella (He/Him)
Sr. Manager - Spring Engineering
mminella@xxxxxxxxxx
3401 Hillview Avenue, Palo Alto, CA 94304
From:
jakartabatch-dev <jakartabatch-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf of Reza Rahman <reza_rahman@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, April 5, 2021
5:11 PM
To: jakartabatch developer
discussions <jakartabatch-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re:
[jakartabatch-dev] GitHub milestones for EE 10 , Batch 2.1
(tentative)
It’s a tough call. As such, the CDI features would not break
backwards compatibility in the sense that it is defined in the
platform: https://eclipse-ee4j.github.io/jakartaee-platform/CompatibilityRequirements.
The changes slated are interesting enough, but probably not
significant enough to warrant being a major release. Maybe if
there are more substantive feature changes it could warrant
being considered major other than essentially CDI and Java SE
version alignment.
Reza Rahman
Jakarta EE Ambassador, Author, Blogger, Speaker
Please note views expressed here are my own as an individual
community member and do not reflect the views of my employer.
On Apr 5, 2021, at 12:08 PM, Michael Minella <mminella@xxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Is this intended to be a 2.1 (backwards
compatible) or a 3.0 (breaking changes allowed) release? A
quick scan through the issues makes me think this should
be more of a 3.0 than a 2.1. Specifically:
- CDI requirement is a breaking change.
- Adding generics and a Java API,
while not a breaking change, is a change big enough
IMHO to warrant a major version bump.
Thoughts?
Michael
Minella (He/Him)
Sr. Manager - Spring Engineering
mminella@xxxxxxxxxx
3401 Hillview Avenue, Palo Alto, CA 94304
From:
jakartabatch-dev <jakartabatch-dev-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf of Reza Rahman <reza_rahman@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sunday, April 4,
2021 9:36 AM
To: jakartabatch
developer discussions <jakartabatch-dev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re:
[jakartabatch-dev] GitHub milestones for EE 10 , Batch 2.1
(tentative)
This looks pretty good to me. Hopefully other folks chime in
too.
Reza Rahman
Jakarta EE Ambassador, Author, Blogger, Speaker
Please note views expressed here are my own as an individual
community member and do not reflect the views of my
employer.
On Apr 1, 2021, at 8:48 AM, Scott Kurz <skurz@xxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
As a small step forward, I made
(tentative, proposed) GitHub milestones out of the
issues I mentioned in my kickoff email last week:
https://github.com/eclipse-ee4j/batch-api/milestone/1
https://github.com/eclipse-ee4j/batch-tck/milestone/1
If this at all seems premature or that we didn't
agree or vote on this, let me say for one, for
bigger themes and directions we can discuss more
here on the ML.
It's just taking that list from my email putting it
into the more public forum of GitHub.
For smaller items on your personal wish list, well,
we could seriously consider any candidate where we
can get all three deliveries made:
* the spec wording
* the jbatch impl update
* additional TCK test(s)
though of course it makes sense to reach consensus
in the issue discussion before starting to code.
I'm noticing this article: https://blogs.oracle.com/javamagazine/java-jakartaee-cdi-ejb-jsf-tijms (which doesn't mention batch since we've
been quiet) mentioning a 1Q22 target date.
That's all for now,
------------------------------------------------------
Scott Kurz
WebSphere / Open Liberty Batch and Developer
Experience
skurz@xxxxxxxxxx
--------------------------------------------------------
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