All right, you're added :-).
Best,
Philip
Hi
Philip,
That’s
absolutely fine.
Regards,
Peter
Hi Peter,
I'm currently writing a response to the IP Team.
If you don't mind, I'll add you to CC.
Best,
Philip
Am 02.09.2015 um 16:17 schrieb Philip
Wenig:
Hi Peter,
you're absolutely right.
I'll discuss it with the IP team. Hopefully the class gets
accepted so that I can prepare Commons Math 3.5 for
Eclipse Orbit.
Best,
Philip
Thanks
Philip for the pointer.
It
is a little strange that they are obstructing its
progress owing to some problem with a RNG. I think
they have made an incorrect decision here: the paper
referenced describes the algorithm for WELL class of
RNGs which is implemented by an abstract class plus
concrete classes containing “good” constants plus a
combination method (without any direct copying of the
reference C code). If they think there are IP
violations here then all implementations of
mathematical functions are problematic!
Regards,
Peter
Hi
Peter,
Apache Commons Math is great library ... but it's hard
getting it through the IP review process. I've already
file a CQ to bring Commons Math 3.5 to Eclipse Orbit:
http://dev.eclipse.org/ipzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=9724
Somehow, "AbstractWell.java" can't be accepted.
Removing causes a plethora of subsequent problems. I'm
trying to resolve that issue at the moment.
Best,
Philip
Hi
all,
In
terms of bikeshedding a package name, I don’t
think it is a big deal even for Diamond. Searching
through our scripts finds less than 100 of them
import of the api and impl dataset packages.
Most
of the other issues are eminently solvable. The
exception would be dependencies: if the jars are
separated out then this should not be an issue. Or
have I misunderstood and there are more problems?
(Why is AC Maths bad?)
Regards,
Peter
Hi all,
I am currently moving the
plug-ins to a new repository (actually not
really a different one, but a fork with the
non-relevant code deleted, that allows for
maintaining the history). I am trying to make
this repo the minimum that enables people to
use datasets without requiring any additional
dependencies. It would be great to get this as
part of a top level project.
By having a repo with a
smaller code base, hopefully it can be API
versioned sooner and IP reviewed in such a way
to solve the EAVP dependency issue.
There is still how to
manage that code base back in Diamond, in
particular moving datasets to a new package
has a cost to Diamond because there are many
Jython scripts in the wild that refer to them.
On 1 September 2015 at
17:55, Torkild Ulvøy Resheim <torkildr@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Hi all,
I wonder if it would make any sense to move
the two plug-ins in question to a separate
repository and namespace and do the
IP-review on those. Moving these should also
rid them of dependencies such as Apache
Commons Math which i understand is
problematic. I like the namespace
“org.eclipse.dataset” but it may be a bit to
generic. In preparation for a top level
science project we may want to call it
“org.eclipse.science.dataset”.
Best regards,
Torkild
> 1. sep. 2015 kl. 18.39 skrev Jonah
Graham <jonah@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>:
>
> Hi all,
>
> If I can chime in with our 2 cents.
>
> Following the SWG meeting in
Trondheim it was great to see the
community get behind the need for a
standardised data api. Based on what I
know of IDataset (and the way it matches
numpy) I am convinced that is the way
forward. However, I do see there is work
to be done to get there.
>
> The issues we see in particular
are:
> 1. There are precompiled jars in
the current dataset plugin - this must
be resolved so it can be all source.
> 2. There are dependencies on
non-orbit approved 3rd party packages-
we started discussing in Trondheim how
some of these can be resolve.
> 3. There are 2 plugins & the
api plugin comes with lots of other
(non-relevant) apis
> 4. The code has not been IP-review
and established as IP clean.
>
> These are all very surmountable,
and in fact we (kichwa coders) would
like to go ahead and do something about
it.
> Jonah is currently working on a
fork of IDataset, which will be a subset
of the current functionality available
in the DAWNSci plug-ins. We need to work
with the folks at Diamond about the best
way to structure this so it can be
reintegrated with DAWNSci & other
Diamond projects, but still be re-usable
for SWG.
>
> The goal will be to get this into a
stage where it can be easily IP-checked
and meets this criteria
> - available in an Eclipse build
infrastructure
> - has a reproducible build from
source
> - IP checked & clean
> - generates a p2 site
> - can be reusued in other projects
in different formats (jars, oomph
installers, the whole works)
>
> Where it is made available is not
nearly as relevant as that it is made
relevant (but FWIW, we would favour a
top-level science project).
>
> We'd like to work with all in the
community to push this forward so will
send a pointer to the fork by the end of
the week and welcome comments.
>
> Oh, and our working title is
org.eclipse.dataset (because we think
this is key for any data whatsoever,
even beyond science).
>
> Regards,
> Tracy
>
>
>
> ~~~
> Jonah Graham
> Kichwa Coders Ltd.
> www.kichwacoders.com
> jonah@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> +44
(0) 1494523014
> +44
(0) 7988836817
>
> On 1 September 2015 at 17:10, <Matt.Gerring@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
> Jay,
>
>
>
> What are the IP issues? How do
official releases vs. other kinds of
releases help? J
>
>
>
> Now that the two plugins are in
DAWNSci* does the rest of DAWNSci have
to pass IP checking? That should be ok,
there is not much which is non-eclipse
and the CQ’s are raised. If EAVP was
waiting for release on DAWNSci it should
be possible to do that with little risk.
>
>
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> *(Which state of affairs I was
pushed into somewhat, if you remember I
did say that they should be a community
project.)
>
>
>
> From: science-iwg-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:science-iwg-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Jay Jay Billings
> Sent: 01 September 2015 16:44
>
>
> To: Science Industry Working Group
> Subject: Re: [science-iwg] IDataSet
in EAVP
>
>
>
> Matt,
>
> The biggest concern, in my mind,
with using it from DAWNSci is not the
license, but the IP issues. If you are
planning an official release of DAWNSci,
then all those issues (eventually) go
away. However, if not, then it isn't
clear how we could "legally" (procedural
sense) use it.
>
> Jay
>
> On Sep 1, 2015 11:12 AM, <Matt.Gerring@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
>
> Jay,
>
>
>
> >> the whole community, me
included, really wants to be able to use
IDataSet with EAVP
>
> Perfect! What is the blocker in
using it right now?
>
>
>
> I suggest to put it in EAVP from
where it is, it is there on the eclipse
github and EPL licensed. Import
statements can be changed later and
eclipse projects can depend on one
another after all.
>
>
>
> Tim suggested sciDataset, so
perhaps the eventual package/project
could be org.eclipse.scidataset? But
before we do that, I would like to
quantify the need from the community of
its location.
>
>
>
> Given that it is two plugins, it
should be pretty easy to create a
project for it faster than EAVP and
ensure that EAVP can make its targets
for releasing with the Eclipse train; if
that is the blocker.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
>
>
> Matt
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> From: science-iwg-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:science-iwg-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Jay Jay Billings
> Sent: 01 September 2015 14:56
> To: Science Industry Working Group
> Subject: Re: [science-iwg] IDataSet
in EAVP
>
>
>
> Matt,
>
> Will you please clarify your
response and be a little more definitive
please? My feeling is that the the whole
community, me included, really wants to
be able to use IDataSet with EAVP. I am
essentially trying to figure out if this
is something that we can plan and push
for as part of our 1.0 release in 6-12
months or if it needs to wait until a
2.0 release sometime after that.
>
> So, are you saying that you don't
know what you're going to do with it
yet? Or are you saying that you want to
propose a new "data structures" project
that we could wait on?
>
> Even a statement of "I need more
time to investigate this" would be fine,
just as long as you say it
unequivocally, because then I can put it
on the potential feature set for the
EAVP 2.0 release next year and leave it
out of 1.0.
>
> Jay
>
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 1, 2015 at 6:04 AM,
<Matt.Gerring@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
>
> Hello Jay and other folks,
>
>
>
> >> Alex noted that you felt
like the "moving IDataSet" option would
make EAVP a competitor to DAWNSci.
>
> To clarify, I said was that at the
point where EAVP does not use IDataset,
it becomes a competitor to DAWNSci J
This is because the numerics become less
compatible but the scope is the same. If
the numerics are compatible it becomes a
collaborator with a similar scope.
>
>
>
> I think our vision for IDataset is
not a visualization specific project but
something more general, just as numpy is
for python. IDataset is two plugins with
few dependencies. Suggestions about
where it sits not specific to any single
use case (visualization, numerics,
scripting, etc) are welcome.
>
>
>
> If we do move, we might need a name
like numjy, jDataset etc. for the
project, again suggestions welcome!
There would also be some Diamond
internal work for me to consider and
agree, likely not a blocker although I
might ask external people register
specific interest in how they will reuse
it and why they want it moved.
>
>
>
> I also reported in the meeting that
IDataset is complete but can be faster
for some operations. When/if speed
issues arise, there are a number of
strategies which can be used already or
new code added J It can deal with data
much larger than available memory, which
is a powerful way at looking at large
data on small computers.
>
>
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> From: science-iwg-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:science-iwg-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Jay Jay Billings
> Sent: 31 August 2015 20:41
> To: Science Industry Working Group
> Subject: Re: [science-iwg] IDataSet
in EAVP
>
>
>
> Everyone,
>
> I should clarify that EAVP is short
for "the Eclipse Advanced Visualization
Project" for those who haven't heard of
it before. It is the viz project that we
have been discussing for awhile.
>
> Jau
>
> On Aug 31, 2015 2:01 PM, "Jay Jay
Billings" <jayjaybillings@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
>
> Matt,
>
> I met with Alex this morning and he
told me how awesome the Norway meeting
was. He also told me that there is broad
support for using IDataSet in EAVP. I
would like to discuss how we can move
forward on this. I strongly support the
use of IDataSet in EAVP and I really
want to see a tight integration because
it is technology that would be very
valuable to what we are doing at ORNL
and, I imagine, other institutions in
this group. There is a very big
technical question that we need to
answer though: Where is IDataSet going
to be released?
>
>
> In one of our previous steering
committee calls you said that DIAMOND
has no intention of doing a "full
Eclipse release" of DAWNSci since your
goal with the project was only to
release the source code, not binaries.
That makes it very challenging to use
anything in DAWNSci in any other SWG
project because it lacks that Eclipse
"technical goodness" that many of our
projects depend on.
>
> So, if you don't mind, let's start
there. What are your release plans for
DAWNSci? If you are planning an
official, Eclipse.org release then I
think we can use IDataSet as it is and
just wait on your release. However, if
not or if not reasonably soon, then I
think you should seriously consider
contributing it to EAVP so that the
community can use it and help develop it
with you.
>
> Alex noted that you felt like the
"moving IDataSet" option would make EAVP
a competitor to DAWNSci. I don't
personally see that since no other
Eclipse projects are competitors to
DAWNSci. I urge you not to look at the
project that way either. It is meant to
be an open, community effort that we all
work on - and use - together.
>
> Please let me know what you think
and let's keep this discussion in the
open so that we can get good thoughts
and ideas from the community. I'm
certain there is a workable path forward
on this.
>
> Jay
>
>
> --
>
> Jay Jay Billings
>
> Oak Ridge National Laboratory
>
> Twitter Handle: @jayjaybillings
>
>
>
> --
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> Oak Ridge National Laboratory
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> Twitter Handle: @jayjaybillings
>
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